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Date: 07.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

This link may interest some of you:

http://www.turnaroundyourhealth.co.uk/Rheumatoid-Arthritis-(RA)-and-Mycoplasma/B173.htm

Quote from it:

"Most doctors believe that infection plays a role in RA. As early as the 1950s Dr. T McPherson Brown proposed that infection may be the clue as to what causes rheumatoid arthritis. He concluded that the species of bacteria called mycoplasma may be the culprit. He found that long-term treatment with the antibiotic group tetracyclines produced long lasting remissions."


Ses also:


http://www.rheumatic.org/

for more information on antibiotic threapy


Also see:

http://www.turnaroundyourhealth.co.uk/Olive%20Leaf%20Extract/K.htm

for information on Olive Leaf Extract.

Hope all of this helps.
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Date: 07.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Sorry, that last link should be:

http://www.turnaroundyourhealth.co.uk/blog.asp?EventID=50
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Date: 07.01.2011
From: kazzie

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

has anyone tried this
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Date: 07.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

I don't think a lot of people are aware of it.
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Date: 07.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Oh yes we are! There have been loads of threads on here about it. And, no, it doesn't help!
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Date: 07.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Have you tried it yourself? I have no idea if it works or not.
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Date: 08.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

My comment was apropos your post, not the treatment lol!

No,I haven't tried either treatments, nor would I. I've looked into antibiotic therapy extensively but can't find any proper evidence or papers that support it. The consultants at my hospital are leading research into RA and they don't support it. I'm about to start a very expensive treatment and can't imagine they wouldn't prefer to give me something that costs pennies if they thought it would be beneficial. My doctors aren't in the business of allowing their patients to suffer unnecessarily. It's too easy to think there is a simple solution out there, they may be, of course, but I don't believe antibiotic therapy is it.
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Date: 08.01.2011
From: kazzie

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

hi bsk what treatment are you starting on as am about to start enbel and thats pretty exspensive and i have had people say oh try this ect ect but i say if that was the case why would they spend all this
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Date: 08.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

hi Kazzie, I am starting Cimzia. Think all the biologicals are very expensive. Lots of people tell me what they think I should do but I trust my consultant and myself. After all, no-one knows better than me what I am having to deal with! Good luck with the enbrel.
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Date: 09.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

I am one of many who use AP & I have been very successful -- it took a while though of tweaking the meds until we found a mix that worked, I have been asymptomatic for around 11 months now.

As for what works & what doesn't depends a lot on how your body reacts to whatever you are taking too, now just what you may choose to use.

I have always found it interesting that some bag the crap out of AP when they haven't tried it & fail to say that nothing else is fool proof either .. so I don't understand what the difference is between trying traditional meds or AP, it's all pretty much hit & miss.

I am sure Jeff is just trying to be helpful !!!
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Date: 09.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

He might well have been Maz, but not to me. If the treatment has been so successful I am surprised you are still posting on here. People usually drift off when they are 'well.' In any case, it might be coincidental that you are feeling better as many people do have periods where they are asymptomatic. It's part of the pattern of the disease

The danger with trying alternative remedies is that you are at risk of developing irreversible joint damage. One may be free of 'symptoms' but the inflammatory action continues regardless. It is well documented. A friend of mine who was evangelical about me trying a gluten free diet has recently found out that the arthritis has been going on regardless of being symptom free and she is now in serious trouble.

One needs to be very careful about what one chooses whether it is alternative or main stream. I don't take any of my drugs lightly and make an informed decision about them that is based on statistics and evidence. When the evidence for antibotic therapy stands up to scrutiny, I might well try it. There just isn't enough at the moment to satisfy my stringent requirements.
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Date: 10.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Sorry you feel that way bsk ..

As for why I am still posting, irregularly I may add, is simple I think everyone needs to hear whether people are better or not no matter what meds they take, it's really sad that people drift off as you put it so any new people can't tell if someone is improving or not.

As for me still having damage continuing, I can assure you that I am checked regularly & to date have no continuing damage; I know I am one of the lucky ones !!

On the flip side I can't find any evidence for trad meds either ...
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Date: 10.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Glad you are staying well Maz. Not everyone is as lucky as you as you say yourself. I'm not saying antibiotics don't work, I am saying there isn't enough evidence to risk it. When there is, I might well try it. However, I stand by my suggestion that you just might be in remission :) Wouldn't that be nice?

To say there is no evidence for trad meds is crass, not to say upsetting for all those who rely on them. Not for me as I am confident in my choices but for others less sure.

In any case, you are just plain wrong. There is scads of evidence. To start with, you hardly see people these days going around with deformed joints like my grandmother had, fingers at right angles at the joints, feet unable to fit into a pair of shoes, wrists at right angles to the arm. THAT is the point of them, THAT is the evidence, not to mention the blood tests and xrays. I know several people who refused to take traditional medicine because they thought the alternatives were better and one of them has deformed hands and another has just had an operation on her foot to realign it. They both thought they 'were well' until the damage was done. Needless to say, they are both on 'trad' meds now.

You tell it like it is from your perspective and I am doing the same. It's not a battle, I'm just giving another view. This illness is just too serious to take risks without being fully informed.
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Date: 11.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Clearly we don't agree, but I can't say trad meds work when my own doctors can't say that; the closest thing they ever say is that the current thinking within the field of rheumatology is to hit it hard initially in the hope that damage may be delayed. As for people with deformed joints you should have a look at how many people are having joint replacements over here.

You are right though I am saying what works for me, but please don't misunderstand I am not now & have never been fanatically anti trad meds at all in fact my closest friend is on trad meds for severe RA. However with all the research I could find available at the time I did make a choice to go down the AP path.

I don't have to agree with you but will support your right to make a whatever decision you choose to make.

I am not saying people should use AP or that people should use traditional medications, the choice is theirs to make. All I am saying is that AP is yet another treatment path they may like to look at.

I couldn't agree with you more about this disease being too serious to do something without being fully informed.
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Date: 11.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Ditto supporting your right too.

I suppose my concern is that not everyone is as well informed as you about treatments and it worries me that someone may refuse any treatment because they see 'trad' meds as bad (though I suppose you could argue that AP is traditional medicine too!)
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Date: 12.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

BSK,

Glad we can have a sort of informed banter between us without it getting nasty and/or personal .. thankyou for understanding my position.

I am of course one of those people who may appear to be forceful about someone new getting as much information as possible both about the disease & all available treatment paths THEN making a decision. I am also supportive of anyone taking what may be a last line of defense med if it helps or they feel it may help. Once someone gets the inflammation & flares under control they may reconsider their options ??

I totally understand what you are saying. I would be worried about anyone new refusing treatment too unless they fully understood what the results may be.
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Date: 12.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Me too - glad etc.

I've had so many people telling what they think I should do. Realise you are not doing that. Who knows, I might even do a little bit more research!
Keep well.
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Date: 12.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

You too BSK ...

Research is interesting isn't it ?? But like you I hate being told by others what I should do, just give me the information & let me decide for myself .. I am an adult, I just happen to have a disease I need to control!
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Date: 13.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Yep! Yesterday I decided to start Cimzia - we'll see whether it's the right thing in time. Anything to feel normal again!
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Date: 13.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Hope it works for you !!
Good luck,
Maz
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Date: 13.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Thanks! I hope it does too. If not, might be joining you on the antibiotic trail.....!
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Date: 15.01.2011
From: Maz

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Hi BSK,

Not trying to persuade you just thought you may find this interesting ??

http://www.hawthornuniversity.org/UnderstandingAutoimmuneDiseasewithDrNikolasHedberg.html
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Date: 23.01.2011
From: billybadtemper

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

hi i just stumbled accross this forum tonight - i am about to start enbrel soon having been on methotrexate for last year - i know someone who has been on enbel for last 3 years in fact she was one of the guinnea pigs pardon the pun for this drug in the uk and swears by it - she was diagnosed 20 years ago (now she mid 40's) and has had lots of joints replaced etc but says that this is the only drug that has improved her quality of life -

how badly are you affected by R A
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

"The danger with trying alternative remedies is that you are at risk of developing irreversible joint damage. One may be free of 'symptoms' but the inflammatory action continues regardless. It is well documented. A friend of mine who was evangelical about me trying a gluten free diet has recently found out that the arthritis has been going on regardless of being symptom free and she is now in serious trouble."

Surely this depends on what alternative treatment you use--even convential meds can mask symtptons.
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Yes, but at least you are monitored on conventional meds. I've been on steroids which mask my symptoms but am under no illusion my disease is being treated.
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

By the way, I just came across this link to a free ebook on how too much acidity and low alkaline levels in the blood can cause arthritis. I've started reading it, it seems pluasible so far. I know that gout is caused by low alkaline levels, so it makes sense that arthritis could also, being similar to gout.
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Sorry..forgot to post link---here it is:

http://www.nhe.net/arthritistreatment/
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

"Yes, but at least you are monitored on conventional meds. I've been on steroids which mask my symptoms but am under no illusion my disease is being treated."

So your real reservation seems to be more about monitoring than alternative treatment itself?
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Partially but also with efficacy.
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

I suppose what puts some people off the conventional meds are the side-effects. That's why I'd be wary of trying them. With the alternative treatments there are no bad side effects--at least nothing potentially lethal.
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Date: 28.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Depends what 'alternative' treatments you are talking about. Some do have bad side effects.Some just don't work and the delay in taking 'conventional' meds can allow damage to the joints to occur. It's just not that straight forward.
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Date: 29.01.2011
From: Jeff

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Here are some news reports on Rose Hip scientific trials to see if it relieves pain in arthritis:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/6763017.stm

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1984024/Rosehip-better-than-painkillers-for-arthritis.html
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Date: 31.01.2011
From: bsk

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Haven't you got anything better to do?
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Date: 15.02.2011
From: George Ashford

Subject: Re: Rheumatoid Arthritis and antibiotic therapy

Hi Billybadtemper,

I work for a market research company that specialises in the medical device field. We are looking for RA sufferers that inject Enbrel, Humira or Methotrexate and either live in the London area or are willing and able to travel to London to take part in an interview. The interview will relate to a new device to help RA sufferers administer their drugs. We will pay £200 to cover expenses and the interview would last approx 90 minutes.

Would you be interested? Please do get in touch if you would like to know more - george.ashford@creativemedicalresearch.com

Best regards,
George
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